Nah IDC if I get de@th threats or not. I will Always hate on yaois that have hetronormativ...

let’s get death threats together. I hate the heteronormativity.

Ayy finally found my twin

i agree but thankfully theres been a lot more buff ukes these days

trueeee.

Y'all just want to see big tiddies Just say it ( me too)

No?

I would explain what my comment/joke meant but man I'm just won't. Anyway, love when the dynamic is really just people ( without stereotypes, like you said too) normally when the couple switch is like that but I'm happy that more manga are doing that too .

Yall realize that ur not any more “woke” for hating on “feminine” bottoms?

(which what the fuck does that even mean? Like they look like girls? They behave submissive? Why is that more feminine huh?)

Yall somehow entirely do a 360 and by that I mean by trying so hard you end up being homophobic somehow by hating on a “specific archetype” and going entirely too hard on the other side - buff bottoms - becuz somehow that means ur better than everyone else by liking it more than twinks (which it’s also fetishizing if you really wanna play that game)

Just becuz he is buff doesn’t take away the “feminization” yall seem to hate sm - full volume for example. He’s not a twink sure but he fits all the damn stereotypes yall r shitting on.

Idgf genuinely never said the bottom being feminine was a problem, the problem is them being so feminine they look like girls And "act" like girls, having exactly the same personality/looks and everything like a women with a top that is so masculine BCS apparently being masculine with a feminine bttm means ur the only one in the relationship who can top, since being feminine is a women's trait. I never in any form said I like buff bottoms, but yes I do prefer them. Even so I also like twinks or normal body sized bottoms. I was never hating on twinks, just to specify that. I was hating on the fact that they always have to be the ones bottoming bcs in some people's eyes, bottoms can only be twinks/feminine since those are exactly the same traits a women has. And was also hating on the fact their tops are also always masculine, rich, buff ect since they also in MOST people's eyes can only top bcs thats how a man in a straight relationship acts/looks like. And if the roles were reversed, suddenly it's surprising and nobody is so obsessed anymore, even using the "I want them.to switch" card, not entirely admitting they hate it cus it's not the usual hetronormative shi but making it very obvious. Also, with full volume, yeah kinda agree with you there, but the bottom being feminine/ a Twink is wayyy more hetronormative (not saying every Twink bottom is) bcs if authors actually wanted to make the gay couples look/act like a straight one, the most visible trait of a women is being feminine and skinny. Doesn't mean bls with buff bottoms can't be hetronormative, but if authors actually wanted to make smth hetronormative then they would make the bottoms feminine, since those are the biggest most visible traits of a women. Ps: if you still wanna argue with me telling me in wrong, don't bother. I won't be replying, not bcs I realized I'm wrong (I haven't), but bcs I know arguing with people that aren't ready to hear the truth and accept it is going to get me nowhere.

That was really long for someone who’s not gonna argue supposedly. I’m not coming at ur throat specifically, just everyone who shits on twinks.

Point is - it’s a backwards as fuck argument to say TWO GAY MEN even in stories is heteronormative. Sure there can be a conversation about how bottoms are treated becuz penetration is considered less masculine and in a position of less power - but that’s the extent of it.

yall just yell in an echo chamber all the time with this “he’s too feminine and too pretty looking and skinny and small so CLEARLY he’s meant to be the placeholder of a woman” AND YOU SAID “the most visible trait of a women is being feminine and skinny.”
WHY?
Since when is being skinny womanly? r u saying big people aren’t womanly? like a man can wear a dress, a skirt, etc. but that’s won’t make him any less of a man and he can be skinny with long hair and yada yada yada… still a man.
Rethink what u consider a “womanly” trait becuz not every woman is skinny, petite, etc.

Btw full volume is a BIG BEEFY bottom. In no way a twink - he’s just very delicate and has “attributes” that can be viewed in a womanly way if you will.

I love every BL story that doesn’t have a stupid bitch, I’m not only preaching for my twink bottoms either - a same body type and small top/bigger bottom trope - All about lust.

I agree

THANK YOUU

Dude I totally agree with you it’s also a part of the reason why I can’t with omega verse, pretty much all omega verse and tbh a lot of BL is extremely hyper feminine, like the most absurd stereotype's towards women on full blast and it’s just such a waste to read, part of the reason why I have very specific dynamics and personalities for BLs I read or even omega verse.

You lowkey cooked them, this is exactly how I feel about people who hate on fem bottoms with out any actual argument. Just say you like buff bottoms… It’s ok.. Also I’ve seen more people asking for switches when the bottom is a twink than vice-versa. And if this person actually cared about heteronormativity and feminization they would have discussed the anatomy differences that even Bara fucking has with the uke having humongous boobs and the seme just having a normal build- THAT IS ALSO FETISHIZATION! AND IS ARGUABLY WORSE.

Ok I never said I hate on twinks, first of all thank you. I said I hate how the dynamic is extremely Twinky and skinny uke x extremely muscular manly seme. Second of all, I'm talking here about stereotypes, if you would look through Josie manwhas on this app you would find that yes, most stereotypical hetro relationships have infact a skinny small women. Reminder, we are talking about stereotypes here, not about what I hate or not. Third, I don't understand where or why u think I hate feminine men?!?! Never said I do. Yes a man can still wear a dress and be a man yada yada, doesn't make the fact that if a very pretty Twinky and skinny man is the uke to a very masculine, muscular much taller than him man doesn't make it hetronormative. Oh and to that one person who mentioned bara, I don't really read bara, but I read ur comment. The argument could be used, from what I heard tho most if not all baras have same build? Boobs not boobs, yeah maybe the focus id more on the ukes boobs, but the seme's also have it. Thats bara tho, I don't really know so I won't comment much. Point is, yes even gay relationships can be hetronormative, not bcs simple relationships are, but bcs they are meant to be seen as such. You can argue that a relationship can't be, but at least the system of it is."But that's only for hetro couples" well yeah it should be, but most of y'all b try and have been putting these stereotypes onto gay men. Even onto lesbians aswell do not fear. Oh and yeah I replied this time bcs somebody CLEARLY did not read my last comment, and now some people think they clocked it.

I’ll make it simple - what did you say? Uke. Seme. BL. Boys love. Yaoi. Men. Man x man.
Doesn’t matter how u cook it, it’s still gay towards the end of the day. Calling it heteronormative just becuz it fits into a stereotype or doesn’t - it’s making that point moot.

It’s man on man action, dick on dick, entirely all peen (tho of course genitals aren’t all to a person) but entirely all men who classify as MEN in these stories.

(Even the ones with cooch they are MEN - see the missing pepper case for example)

Again, just becuz they are sometimes drawn pretty doesn’t make it heteronormative which by definition is: denoting or relating to a world view that presents gender roles as fixed and heterosexuality as the normal or preferred sexual orientation.

A GAY relationship can’t fall under the “fixed gender roles” or “heterosexuality” UNLESS YOU ARE SPECIFICALLY CORRELATING THE BOTTOM BEING IN THE POSITION OF SOLEY A WOMAN.
Does penetration make it “heteronormative”? And are you going against the grain by making them muscular, bigger, smaller, thinner, etc? Cuz towards the end of it THEY STILL MAKE THE MUSCULAR BEEFY BOTTOMS ACT “feminine” by all counts.

Really, this is all smutty stories meant to be engaged by a female audience. It’s not the biggest deal so I don’t think anyone needs to be putting a moral high ground just becuz they do or don’t consume certain stories.

Ur point literally makes no sense, well yes hetronormative should say HETRO, but itisnt. Matter of fact I don't even think u know what hetronormative is. It's STEREOTYPES, where people in a certain position have to be seen as or do certain things bcs they are a certain position. One doesn't out right have to say it to make it clear. Example: a top must be muscular and very manly, or else he has to bottom! Do you seriously think anybody would say that out loud? Nope, nope they won't. But by the way they view seme's and ukes as it will be obvious. No liking skinny uke x muscular seme isn't hetronormative, it's a preference. Yes seeing ukes as small, pretty, tiwnky and seme's as big, muscular, manly is. Yes suddenly going crazy about wanting the couple to switch when the seme is feminine but not giving the same energy to feminine ukes is Hetronormative. Bcs a position does not define you. It seems you didn't understand the meaning from the start, so please, for the love of god, look it up. And stop spitting bullshit. You said man on man? Dick on dick? Well people do not view it that way. They view man on bottom, dick on hole, TOP ON BOTTOM, Man (aka top) on women (aka bottom) but they'll never admit it, bcs they are to scared to say it out loud. Why do you think it's called "whos the wife"? Or "who wears the pants?' ?!?!?THAT IS HETRONORMATIVE.

Did you read anything I just said seriously. Did you understand that that definition is directly from the dictionary. Did you comprehend any of my points?
You’re verbatim spitting the shit I already rebuked AGAIN while somehow doing it in the most confusing and convoluted way.

Again, easy to read points:
1. Feminine ukes or tinier ukes is NOT heteronormative - Heteronormative BY THE MERRIAM WEBSTER DICTIONARY IS BY DEFINITION “of, relating to, or based on the attitude that heterosexuality is the only normal and natural expression of sexuality”
2. SO then continuing from the prior point - are ANY FUCKING WOMAN involved in BL? BOYS LOVE? YAOI? I’ll answer for you, no it’s men.
3. Liking it the opposite way, is (ur right) a preference but it does not make you smarter or morally superior for consuming the media differently than others. An uke being the smaller one receiving does not make them any less of a man even if they’re fucking written as meek, scared, homely, etc.
4. People want them to switch either way, either or, doesn’t matter who’s bigger or not. It’s always always been a conversation the fandoms have had - example: love stage when pretty uke tops the seme at the end.
5. You’re all running in circles trying to justify this view you have of an uke, a bottom, being feminine = bad becuz it’s pandering to this hetero stereotype all the while talking about a man x man written for a primarily WOMEN audience. How can you miss the irony of the clear misogyny of hating an uke all becuz he’s written a certain way that yall deem “womanly” or too “feminine” becuz u want them to be macho and strong.
6. Everyone and I mean everyone can fall under a stereotype and who tf cares? Just as sometimes they avert it and they’ll still be stereotyped. A small top is still viewed as a “pretty top” and a big bottom is seen as a “handsome bottom” and vice versa in the OG issue of “pretty bottom x handsome top” let’s be for real here. There is no diverting any stereotypes when he consuming media that’s made for female consumption. For example: red string quest. It’s gorgeous story, gorgeous art, gorgeous characters all for what? Female consumption.

Final point being: An uke, a bottom, is not any less enjoyable or more enjoyable just becuz they fit a stereotype or don’t - it’s all up to preference as you said.
It’s straight up misogynistic somehow to hate on an uke fitting into roles yall deem as too feminine becuz inadvertently you’re viewing it as a bad thing and boxing women into a stereotype as well. And having these conversations of media that’s man x man made for women is somehow even whacker considering the fact it takes women out of the equation for their own pleasure.

Yeah no please look up the meaning of hetronormative stereotypes. If you want I can even send u a few links to videos explaining them. If you don't want it's ur decision, stay uneducated if that's what u want ig.