I'm confused at why people think its rape and sexual assault. maybe I'm just open minded a...

they don’t have... a bdsm relationship. they’re a married couple and if one side of the relationship doesn’t want sex at that moment but the other one forces it on them, it is rape.

I never said these characters had a bdsm relationship. I can tell you're just ready to argue. i just meant it that every relationship is different and had there own set of boundaries. calling it rape simply because it looks unpleasant and unwanted isnt always right when you're viewing from the outside in. in a real life stance, think of it like tickling, it's just playful. knowing your partners boundaries really plays a big part but because its fictional characters, we cant really know what's crossing the line or not. from day one, idk his name but the bottom always had that unpleasant whiney looks on his face, that's probably just his character. I just dont get how people are comfortable calling rape when they chose to ignore the dynamics of the relationship

if I had a relationship and it was a situation like this, I would be playfully bratty. of course i enjoy what sexual thing is happening, to me, I just find it fun giving my top a hard time and not wanting to easily give in him. of course it can look unwanted if you know nothing about the relationship, realistically speaking, but if you randomly shown up and said my bf was raping me, because we know our own boundaries within our relationship, we would look at you like you lost your mind.

First off, bdsm is based on consent. When did Dojin and Hyesung BOTH consented to have this kind of dom/sub relationship? Never. Dojin IS forcing himself on Hyesung, and Hyesung DOESN'T like it. He told him to stop, and Dojin didn't. What's not clicking?

read the replies, where did I say they had a BDSM relationship? even so, it is based off consent and since we're on the topic, there are types of bdsm relationship where yes and no arent used for consent and instead, they use safe words. I'm explaining that different relationships have different dynamics and it's hard to know that dynamics in fiction unless it's all in our faces very clearly. calling rape to a relationship that doesn't typically use yes or no is wrong because its fiction and judging by body language, it doesnt seem like much of a struggle was taken. either that or the author really sucks at drawing scenes where its meant to be obvious

YES AND NO ARENT THE ONLY WORDS USED FOR CONSENT and that's why majority of you dont understand different relationship dynamics and call rape so quickly without thinking, "well maybe the boundaries in this relationship is different" btw, even it comes to bdsm, your comment is still really incorrect because safe words exist and no and yes can be ignored in that type of relationship depending on the parties (:

I see and understand your point, but imo something like that has to be "officially" (that's kinda the wrong word, but I can't think of another one lol) established between the partners. Like you have to talk about that and both need to clearly consent to it, otherwise it might be kinda dangerous. "No" and "Stop" are important words and you can't just decide on your own that those words have no meaning anymore, just because you think your partner is fine with it. It doesn't matter how well you know each other you can't read each others minds so misunderstandings are always possible, that's why open communication are so important.
As long as your partner hasn't agreed that you can keep going even though they said no and/or stop, you should actually stop, because otherwise it is actually assault or rape then.
Anyway I'm glad to see someone, who is open for respectful discussions. So many ppl here get so aggressive, just because they have another opinion. D:

Exactly. Body language is used for consent, manipulation is used to make the other consent to whatever you wanna do. Funny huh, because Hyesung's body language says no, and Dojin manipulates him, making him feel like it's his fault for making him jealous. As in bdsm, sexual intercourses should always be consented beforehand. I don't know why you just don't get it

that's not what I meant when I said those words can be ignored. obviously if both parties are into certain things, all they would ask if "hey, I'm into this, are you" "i am, let's do it" that's the thing, people think a yes or a no are the ONLY words that can be used when its comes to sexual relationships. people forget that boundaries exist and types of boundaries exist

my other example but brattyness and.playfulness. some people really just enjoy being brats and whine a lot so from the outside, looking into a relationship, it can seem.unpleasent and like rape HOWEVER, couples know their own boundaries and can keep being playful with their partner because they know each others comfortable levels
the bottom in this story has always been on the whiney, dramatic side and that's just their dynamics and it's hard for me to consider is rape when theres so many chapters letting us know and understand what their relationship is like. if my bf is touching on me and I'm PLAYFULLY whining "stop no" and he keeps doing it, it's not sexual assault and it's not rape because we both know our relationship and out own boundaries. but if I'm "no, im not in the mood" and using my body language to show that I'm genuinely not in the mood, he'll back off. the bottom was literally clinging onto the top. if there relationship dynamic was different where yes and no is used literally and the top kept going, then yes he would have raped the bottom. I just hate how toxic and uneducated these comments sections can be. the bottom can literally say "ignore me.saying no" and the comment section would still call rape because they dont know any better or different types of relationships actually exist

how is making the bottom feel bad for watching porn correlate to the quote on quite rape? did this rape happen with the sex toy of when the top actually got on top of him and he apologized for watching porn :/

and I never said in the bringing stages of talking about certain bdsm relationships, talking and consenting to it never happens. I meant with couples ALREADY into that type of thing together. dont put words in my mouth because you so badly want to prove your point. I'm sticking with my point. relationship dynamics really matter with these type of things and people call rape to anything that seem unusual to them when in reality, it's just a relationship dynamic they're not used to. if you feel the bottom is constantly being raped and.manipulated, then shit, that's you lmfao but if I think that WITH ALL THE CHAPTERS, showing us how their relationship is and.noticing their personal boundaries, that its.not rape, then its whatever

That's manipulation? He's telling him oh, look how unfaithful you are for looking porn that /I/ purposely set on the laptop for you to watch! This would be okay if it was a play, if they both talked about it beforehand and decided to have fun trying new things out, but after taking a look at Hyesung's horrified face, does it look to you that he was having fun?

I am sorry to break your delusions, but literally EVERYONE has enough common sense to acknowledge that Dojin has raped Hyesung many times, and did it once more in this chapter. This isn't their "relationship dynamic", Hyesung probably got used to being assaulted by Dojin, but it's still wrong.

my delusion? lmfao of what, taking time to evaluate the situation before using rape as every conclusion for things I dont understand. like i said, I feel like it was a playful moment and that's how I see it because of how the bottom was reacting to everything. even if most people in the comment section think the same way as you do, my opinion isnt going to magically changed based on the majority, I'm not a sheep, I dont need to follow the herd. im not saying what you're saying cant happen because what you say is true but for this type of relationship, I dont think that's what happening. you can say I'm being delusional, for whatever reason you pulled that term out of your ass lmfao, but that's what how I think about this exact scene. the bottom literally always had "that look" on since face since day one and yet with everything going on in this entire series, it doesnt seem like the bottom hates or dislike the relationship or what happens in it. literally said "look at those muscles" in his inner thoughts. but if you feel like the bottom had been manipulated since day one and that's why he feels everything is okay now, okay good for you for having that opinion but for me, I just think that's how their dynamic is. it's not a delusion, I just thought about, felt rape was too harsh of a word and figured this scene was on the playful side. if at the end of the day, im not looking to argue and.be aggresive on the internet. if this "manipulation and rape" gets you heated yet you managed to read and keep up with everyone inch of the story yet gets so upset,.just stop reading it and allow the people who are evaluating the dynamic closely discuss their thoughts without trying to make a sad attempt at being tough

not only that, in a manhwa, we can literally see the characters thoughts. the bottom, at least from what I remember has never had such bad thoughts about the top. if the manhwa was meant to show manipulation and rape, then it wouldve been clear in the thoughts of the characters. so how come if it's the way you say the story is, how come to thoughts of the character is so different?

You're just assuming that Hyesung is into that stuff tho and hell maybe he is, but maybe he actually isn't. To you it may feel like he's into it, but since he never actually said it how can you be so sure? Maybe you misunderstand his actions.
Like I've known my mom my whole life, but there are still misunderstandings between us a lot of times that's why i gotta actually say stuff out loud to make sure there's no misunderstanding. The same goes for romantic relationships. It's simply too risky to just assume your partner is into a certain dynamic just because that's how it seems to you. You gotta talk about important stuff like that. Being in love doesn't mean you can read each others minds.
And sure body language is often used to show consent in a relationship, but words are important, too -especially since ppl may interpret body language differently- and Hyesung definitely said "no" and "stop" and he did even try to get away at first so the body language wasn't quite right either, that's why to me that didn't really seem playful. Dojin can't just disregard words just because HE thinks it's fine.

when I meant those type of relationships, I was speaking for REAL LIFE relationships to make a realistic example for what a saying because like you said, we cant know for sure especially since its fictional. and you're right, we really dont know and that's why I chose not to throw the word rape around aimlessly because I really dont know hence why I said "I'm confused why people are calling this rape" im not just going to throw around a word like that and based on the fact that it is a story, we have the ability to look into a characters thoughts. yeah it may LOOK rapey, but is it really? when we can clearly see the thoughts of the character as the scenes go on

that's the thing about this and other stories. if its not.really clear, then we all just left to form our own judgment and I dont have harsh judgments unless I'm able to make a clear opinion based on all the negatives in the story

and thanks for having a level conversation with me. its nice!

That'a a really good point and it definitely makes me rethink some stuff. However I think that doesn't mean we cannot critcize Dojin at all (hating on him or his fans is of course not okay, but like actual criticism), because since we really can't be sure about the characters feelings, rn both possiblities (bratty dynamic or actual assault) coexist, so why shouldn't we be able to critcize Dojin if the possiblity of this actually being assault does exist.
Like maybe it wasn't rape, but maybe it was and in that case we should most definitely not condone Dojim's behaviour.
That of course also means that it should also be fine to not critcize him since the other possiblity still exists as well.
Before it kinda annoyed me how ppl tried to excuse Dojin's actions since to me it definitely seemed like assault, buut since I understand your point I take that back. Both point of views are fine imo, since we really can't know for sure what's actually the case. Which also means we really shouldn't call Dojin a rapist with 100% certainty, I see that now.
That being said many ppl in this comment section just need to learn some basic respect. Both sides just attack each other in so many cases, it's sad.

Man I hope you understand what I mean, I kinda struggled to put i into words haha. It's just as long both possiblities are there we should consider and talk about both of them. A little bit like Schrödinger's cat, in case your familiar with that experiment.

OF COURSE I UNDERSTAND. we can criticize characters but calling rape isnt a criticism, but pointing out how his jealousy and possessive gets out of control is a big problem in the story and effects how their relationship can seem. but I do agree with you and thank you for understanding me as well. I wasnt really clear on my words neither.

hyesung literally tells him to stop you goddamn moron. and i pray you never have a relationship and are a top because just because you think something is being “playful” they could genuinely not be. what you said about randomly showing up and saying something is rape- i agree because you know what, hyesung 80% probably wouldn’t say it was rape because they’re married. but goddamn, put this through your head: if someone, no matter the person, is FORCING themselves on another person, it is RAPE. i don’t CARE about no fucking “power dynamic”, if this were a real scenario and hyesung DID feel as if he were raped, it would be people like you that would be the reason people probably wouldn’t believe him.

not you tryna go off LMFAO. as I said in my first comment I WAS CONFUSED AS TO WHY people were calling it rape and I said felt playful like saying "bae stop" in a playful way. like I said in other comments, WE CAN SEE THE CHARACTER'S THOUGHTS. if it's meant to be genuinely 100% rape and the author was going for that look, then we would've known. I just find it funny how we can see the thoughts of characters thinking about the situation in a positive light and people STILL call it rape because it SEEMED rapey. you don't have to hope I have nothing ☠ me and my future partner would have a basic understanding of personal boundaries outside of two words and both would have a mutual understanding of our playful side. if you felt like it was rape GO AHEAD BABE, WITH ALL YOUR HEART. but while I can see the characters thoughts BEFORE AND AFTER the situation, expressing how enjoyable it was, I would never call rape just so easily. like I said earlier, we're all left to judgment and opinions in our own way. if you're heated because I felt like it was playful, that's your fault for being sensitive to a comment that wasnt even aggresive .

and since you're do concerned about my relationships, it's my partner told me to ignore no and stop, only stop when a safe word is called, bet you I'm gonna keep going because that's a boundary my parenteral set for me. stay pressed

mmm contradictory, isn’t it sweet. so YOU can see it as hyesung being all “bAe sToP” but when i get a bad, rape vibe from it, it’s invalid? please shut up