Stormborn's Topics (837)

Wow, it's been so long!!

Wait it's been that long already?

That’s why I just wait every 6 months to a year to catch up because the manga is paced like a weekly one instead of a monthly one.

And as interesting the arc being split up to 4 perspectives and fleshing out Phantomhive crew, the pacing is really dragging this time around. At least, we’re nearly 3/4s into it and we’re getting at least a year’s worth of chapters of the two in few months.

Although is the pacing that bad when some even didn’t notice it’s been years since Sebastian and Ciel last appeared?

Did notice tho. Never stopped noticing since they "disappeared" :/

the pacing is completely fine and I don't think forgetting how long ago Sebastian and Ciel made an appearance is a bad thing, A lot of things happened in the chapters that you don't pay attention to that. I don't think it's all that important and this current arc is interesting so I don't mind if it's longer than the other ones.

Yes, the pacing basically IS fine and I wouldn't either, but: For a manga that's not monthly scheduled.
But since I'm reading the manga bc I love its protagonists, 5+ years without them is a bit aka too long.

You’re welcome! Hope u enjoyed it!

I believe they think that is what sells undoubtedly the most and they are not that wrong either, because for some reasons it does sell a lot; because of the trigger, because of the fans that love this type of fiction, because of the fans that only loves red flags, or just because the author likes and is free to do the unthinkable... ╮(￣▽￣)╭
But to me, what really sells me are: the artstyle, hot characters, interesting plot and nice and consent smutty positions, body built, steamy and romantic scenes, well grounded innerthoughts, their development, their growth as a character etc.
Sadly, I got used to read it happen, I just gotta forget it immediately or laugh about it because so far I enjoy the rest of the plot and the characters... what know for sure I won't do is buy it.

Sorry, I just let out all what I personally think, also I may be wrong in some of the things tho' ⁄(⁄ ⁄·⁄ω⁄·⁄ ⁄)⁄

Let's see when will they update all the correct chapters and officials ε=ε=(ノ≧∇≦)ノ♡♡♡♡

this is nothing against you, i just hate it when consumers complain about why something exists within a space for as long as it has and why it refuses to go away. it's quite obvious that women like this stuff. if women didn't like it, then it wouldn't sell. we have to remember that this is still a business at the end of the day and mangakas aren't going to waste their time and precious sleep to create content that no one will buy.

i can't come to the comment section without one person complaining about yaoi having r*pe and abuse. if it's so bad, why continue to read it and why not comb through the tags/comments to see if it has trigger warnings before you start reading it? this let's me know that isn't as bad they claim it is bc they're consciously reading it from start to finish and bc it feels morally wrong, they project. shounen ai is literally right there and they still come to the yaoi genre to constantly nag us about how immoral it is.

I would ask you to please refrain from making generalizing statements like "women like this stuff".

"this let's me know that isn't as bad they claim it is bc they're consciously reading it from start to finish"

You do realize that these series are being made and released on a chapter by chapter basis often over *years*, yes? Official tags from story start - from what little there is, have a tendency to be vague to such an extent that there is no telling ahead of time. There is *no way* to predict where a story that you start reading and grow to like will end up e.g. a year later, and this is also what a lot of people who may have been following and liking a story and its characters for a long time, only to have a sudden often ooc non-con insert sprung on them late in the story, are upset about.

In other cases, people can and do read series they might not like everything about, and they are free to discuss throughout what they are liking and not liking about a story. The classic (faulty) argument of "don't read if you don't like something about it" could be made about you reading the comments if you dislike them in the exact same way - "Why do you keep reading the comment section if you have an issue with people writing they dislike non-con?" I'm assuming the answer would be the same - despite not liking what some of the comments say, you still clearly seem to want to read the comment section in general, and be able to express your opinions.

Also, there is a major difference between just mature content and non-con, so I don't see what point you are trying to make with the shonen ai comparison. Yaoi does not and should not automatically equate to non-con content. The genre only means it has *explicit* content - and I have certainly yet to see anyone complain in the comment section about a yaoi series being explicit
There are shonen ais that story wise contain non-con and vice versa - explicit / yaoi series that don't. The difference between shonen ai and yaoi is only in how explicitly any mature content is shown.

Bruh, people come for the smut. Not the rape. Yaoi is heavily saturated with it. Rape may not be triggering in a story but if you see it a lot in a sub-genre, it can get tiring and a little disturbing, but not mentally jarring. Rape plots are still weird but its annoying to drop shit when you read like 40 chapters already lol

Also, this feels like some weird misogyny shit...? Women have been fed media that normalizes abusive hetero relationships and only in recent times have there been legitimate discussions about its prevalence. But it still is a common occurrence in films and books. 90% of adult rape victims are female and you wonder why there might be some internalized issues involving sexual abuse in a sub-genre marketed to straight cis women??? Like bruh, you do not want to start this conversation.

And besides how the fuck are you supposed to know there is rape in a story if you read chapters as they release..?

And if you don't feel guilty yourself, why the hell would you feel the need to make a response about people "nagging?" You feel the same guilt you're trying to accuse other readers of having.

lets go paragraph by paragraph lol.

* i made a generalizing statement bc i’ve been indulging romance media for a very long time. from wattpad, romance books, shoujo, k-dramas, romance movies, etc. i can tell you wholeheartedly that women do enjoy this stuff. it doesn’t matter what platform, there will always be some variation where a male protagonist is invading the main lead’s consent/boundaries. keep in mind female writers dominate this space.

* sure. i’ll give you leeway and agree that these stories do take years to finish, authors can change their mind on how they want a story to progress, and readers have a right to be upset about it.

* sure. i’ll also give you leeway on people being able to discuss what they like and dislike about a story. where i draw the line is that i shouldn’t read the comment section bc i’m going to see comments i don’t like. there’s a difference between me reading comments to get a general consensus on what’s being discussed and reading a story that has non-con/abuse in it even though they know it’s a hard boundary and they dislike it very much. these two actions don’t weigh the same in comparison. but sure, i’m not king of the comment section. i can’t tell people what to do. being upset about a story containing something you dislike and complaining does show a pattern though.

* i made the point with shounen ai bc it’s not going to contain the dark themes they obviously want to avoid. well duh, it doesn’t mean non-con, but if you’ve been reading it for as long as i have, then you’ll know the entire genre is problematic within itself. 8 to 9 times out of 10, i expect there to be non-con and/or some dark theme to be presented within an author’s body of work. it’s what sells. if you read what i stated about it being a business, then you’d understand that as well. the best way to change things within a space you don’t like is to stop reading it.. simple. businesses change when the money stops rolling in, so until then…

* i never said that people complain about yaoi for being explicit. the argument is that yaoi stories contain non-con/abuse. well duh, i know that. my statement still stands. a reader is more likely to find the opposite content they’re looking for within a shounen ai compared to a yaoi depending on the traits of the individual within the story OR they proactively comb through the tags/comments to get a feel of what a story has before reading it.

* side note: this entire discussion makes me laugh bc we’re talking about a demographic that made stories like BJ alex, POTN, killing fucking stalking, etc. popular and that’s just from the manhwa section. i do not take what some of you say seriously bc your actions are not aligning with your words.

i come for the smut too. yes! exactly. you’re literally proving my point. yaoi genre is saturated with it, so EXPECT it. anytime i come on to this website, there’s at least 2-3 (i’m being very generous) yaoi books being promoted to readers. so something isn’t adding up with what you’re saying. is it jarring? yeah, but it isn’t something people dislike heavily bc not only does it bring a lot of traffic to this site, people spend a lot of money to read these stories. i’ll agree with you on the part of seeing it 40 chapters in being annoying though.

lmaoo no you didn’t. why are you pulling the misogyny card? is this twitter?

yeah, i agree, but it’s literally 2023. we literally live in a capitalistic society where the goal is to consume. businesses cater to consumers bc they want your money. it wouldn’t exist if WE (i’m including myself) didn’t consume it so heavily. it’s still a common occurrence bc we continue to consume media that contains things that we “dislike.” two statements can be true and exist within the same vacuum: women make up the majority of sexual assault cases AND they like dark romance.

you’re an adult or i’m assuming you are. you have agency and common sense. you already stated that the genre is saturated with non-con/abuse so the fact that you’re not expecting a story to possibly contain it in the future is very telling.

i don’t feel guilty bc i embrace the darker aspects of myself that likes this stuff. i read it all the time and it brings me pleasure. i don’t lie to myself about what it should be, how it should be, what it could be, etc. i accept it for what it is. i like it. i understand all women aren’t like me, so i understand the sentiments about hating this stuff and wanting something that’s normal and/or healthy. it can be taxing on the mind. i’m accusing the collective bc the collective complains about what this genre entails, but they still consume it. actions are not adding up with people’s words. it makes you guys look hypocritical.

With all due respect, the more I read, the statements you make here just continue to be generalizing, rude, and condescending - to everyone. That is not a way to have a discussion. Regardless of your own gender (which I do not know) you are in no position to speak for all women and what they like. There is a difference between commenting on a perceived general trend in certain fiction genres like romance or your own *personal* preferences and making generalizing statements about women - again, *please refrain from the latter*.

The fact that, as you say, you do not take the things others are trying to say seriously sadly seems to show even in the fact that you clearly did not actually bother to properly *read* the above message before replying to it. Of course it's up to you if you feel like taking the time to read and understand what someone is trying to say, and it's ok if you decide not to, but then there is also not really much of a point in replying.
I'll just refer one more time to the message above.

Hint: I did not say you should not read the comment section. I was pointing out the problem with such a statements. The "don't like don't read" argument is oversimplifying the problem and faulty for the exact same reasons - whether it's used on people reading a series that has parts they dislike - or you reading the comment section that has parts you dislike. See above.

I'd really recommend looking deeper into the definitions of what yaoi and shonen ai as genres actually mean. See also the message above. You still seem to be making some very misleading assumptions about both shonen ai and yaoi (or rather, "explicit BL" genre and "non-explicit BL" genre), possibly based on what kind of specific series you personally have read, and what kind of content you personally prefer.

COOKED AND DEVOURRREDDD thank you for not making me have to say thiss!! Emphasise on how much of a logical fallacy the 'dont like dont read' saying is

this will also be my last time responding to you bc it's quite obvious that we're talking from different perspectives lol.

- hm.. i don't necessarily think so, but sure. i'll let you have that one. i'm having a discussion with you and anybody else that disagrees. it just seems to me that what you seem to take offense to is that i'm pointing out an observation i've made (in this case, a generalization from your pov) and you don't like it nor agree which is fine. people who are in communities where they are amongst people who share the same interests they do make generalizations about those within that group all the time.. but ok. obviously all women aren't the same, but if a demographic is flocking to content and that content continues to be produced one can infer... you can fill in the blank. ok, sure. mind you, the trend reflects in the content that's being produced.

- no, i read it. i just didn't agree. you're repeating yourself bc you're trying to make a case about people having the right to speak up about what they dislike in the genre which i stated i understand. you obviously didn't read that either, so i'll just move on.

- sure. i misspoke in certain aspects, but my entire piece about the two sentiments not holding the same weight still stands. again, i use the "don't like, don't read" stance from a business perspective. but i think you are coming at this from a more.. empathetic and/or autonomous pov where users should be allowed to express themselves and read what they like.

- i know what it means. i'm not arguing about explicit vs. non-explicit. i'm arguing over content that is healthy vs. toxic and what it means to actually establish change within a space that readers find problematic. a reader is MORE LIKELY going to find it (meaning healthy content) in a shounen ai vs. yaoi. am i saying that readers should not indulge in explicit content without having to see r*pe/abuse? no. i'm saying that it is well-known that yaoi as a genre is known to have a lot of toxic/dark themes involved within it that is very problematic, so one must either: A) proactively try to avoid it as much as possible, B) don't read it, and/or C) accept it for what it is. i already said that i can understand those who have it sprung up on them without warning, but i guess you didn't see that either lol.

anyway, it was nice chatting with you. this was good practice for me tbh.

lmaoooo people on this website are so funny. ╮(￣▽￣)╭

oh and i forgot to state that haerim stated what i was trying to say all along. she really gets it. like no bullshit, this stuff sells like hotcakes and women get offended when you tell them they're the reason why the content never changes. just bc a mangaka draws this stuff, it doesn't mean that you have to consume it. how you change the genre is by using your dollars and ignoring what you DON'T want to see, not complaining in a comment section on why it continues to exist. that's why my argument holds merit.

You ate them up

That’s the dumbest shit ever. There are so many popular stories that don’t have rape or SA. BL fans don’t consume rape-specific stories. They will just consume anything, whether its morally good or morally bad. Authors can make any kind of BL because of how in-demand the genre is. Its up to them to change the industry. And besides, you like rape in stories so stop pretending like you give a fuck about the industry changing. Just keep it pushing. Again, the only reason your talking shit is because YOU feel guilty.

nah, it’s not but i can see why you think that bc most of the shit you typed up was not only dumb as fuck but it made no sense.

let me say it one last time: YOU are the CONSUMER. A mangaka can only CREATE what YOU, THE CONSUMER, is WILLING to INDULGE IN. no artist is going WASTE their TIME, HEALTH, or SLEEP to CREATE something that nobody wants. CHANGE happens through you, THE CONSUMER. it’s really that fucking easy. anything else you have to say does not fucking matter bc at the end of the day, change is done through ACTION not passivity. worry less about my character and ask yourself why you continue to indulge in stories & spaces that are obviously PROBLEMATIC.

the fact that you stated BL fans don’t consume that content and then turned around to say they’ll consume anything just put the nail in the coffin for me. it’s so fucking dumb, it hurts. like you can’t be this stupid.

It was most likely the Undertaker telling R!Ciel or he brought R!Ciel to watch

From what I recall, Snake wasn't part of the orphan group that kidnapped kids -- he was a circus addition the main group found and invited since they didn't have a Snake charmer act. So he didn't know what they were doing.

Oops sorry my brain is fuzzy. I meant the Undertaker most likely told Doll what happened. He couldn't have brought her to the crime scene in time most likely, so erase that theory