It isn't a bad manga, but Katou is a spoiled brat. An orgy? Really? The matter isn't that it was an orgy, the matter is that he did that when they were already together. I think Iwaki is just too good for him. After doing that, I don't think he even has the right to be jealous over anything. （￣へ￣）
Maybe, but by then Katou already said that he loved him, and started living together. I think if it came out of his own mouth, it wouldn't be so bad. If he wasn't even sure about what he was feeling or his sexuality, he shouldn't have said that he loved him to start with. After he got that right, then he should say that (=・ω・=).But, well, that's just what I think xD
Maybe, but by then Katou already said that he loved him, and started living together. I think if it came out of his own mouth, it wouldn't be so bad. If he wasn't even sure about what he was feeling or his sexu... Lalla
Well I also don't like cheating themes in mangas, however on a cheating scale the most impersonal form is orgy because it is solely based on sex, it is even a bohemian, erratic and circumstantial (under the spur of the moment) form of sex. The most personal form of cheating would be having a mistress or a lover along with the "official" one. At first I didn't like this particular piece of news, I didn't see it coming given the fact how much Katou is possessive of Iwaki-san. However, after listening to Katou's explanation and taking into consideration that he has a childish part in him, it is no surprise that he cheated and hid it. From his perspective, it wasn't "cheating" because back then he said that Iwaki was not reciprocating his feelings, the thing which was making him unhappy and drove him maybe into despair. It is true that he moved to Iwaki's apartment but for him he wanted the same intensity he was showing to Iwaki (he said that he was being "cold" towards him back then). However, being the person he is (with that childish aspect in his personality) he retreated into a familiar shell (sex) instead of working his way through his "problem" and waiting till Iwaki opens up to him the way he wanted to. From his perspective, he had doubts (maybe Iwaki didn't love him, maybe this "thing" wasn't going to work out), hence the orgy was supposed to be a test (maybe after doing it, he will discover that all his feelings for Iwaki were an illusion - after all, and in spite of the fact that he used to be a "lady - killer", he has fallen for a man, which is unusual given his past - and if that were to happen, then he would have found a way out of his unhappiness). This way of thinking is to be expected because all what Katou had in the past were flings and I don't believe that he was in a serious relationship before or that he had these intense feelings towards someone before. If he were a little bit more experienced, a little bit more mature, he wouldn't have doubted his feelings and hence wouldn't have cheated. For me this orgy "affair" is exactly like when a child is sulking and starts to break things out of spite. Not telling Iwaki about it and insisting that he would never tell him something like that (even if there were other similar "mistakes") because he didn't want to see him hurt and crying, is part of this irrational bratful but still wonderful madness which characterizes Katou. Iwaki understands that and this is why he forgave him, especially after he saw his reactions when Iwaki was going to fall from the bridge. For me Iwaki compensates for whatever Katou lacks, if he weren't mature, strong and generous (because forgiving is a form of generosity) this relationship would have never worked and if Katou weren't bratful (but still genuinely affectionate, caring and passionate towards Iwaki), Iwaki wouldn't have loved him back. In a sense, they complete each other. Hence this is a well-thought of and touching romance story (with adult themes to spike it).
Well I also don't like cheating themes in mangas, however on a cheating scale the most impersonal form is orgy because it is solely based on sex, it is even a bohemian, erratic and circumstantial (under the spu... Lilas
I get your point. However, his explanation was nothing else than his own indecisivisiness, I think it's normal to be kind of freaked out by the fact that you fell in love with a person of the same sex, but before you do anything like commitment, you should be sure of what you want. If going to that orgy party would make him feel assured about what he was feeling, the least he could do out of respect for Iwaki was to tell him with his own words at some point. We can see pretty clearly how much Katou loves Iwaki, I agree, but..in some sense, he has always been lying. Like in that incident right at the start, where Katou was seen with some woman, I agree that they might be just friends..but, at the time, he said that He wouldn't cheat on him;That he loved him; And all the same, he would get angry whenever Katou was with anyone, but with what right? Katou is indeed a brat, but if he would have given this enough thought out of guilty, I think he would have grown a little. I actually just felt disappointed, because I did think they were a good couple. However, exactly for Iwaki being mature, I don't think the person he loves back would neccessarily be a brat like Katou. In other words, I just think he deserves someone better. ^^
I get your point. However, his explanation was nothing else than his own indecisivisiness, I think it's normal to be kind of freaked out by the fact that you fell in love with a person of the same sex, but befo... Lalla
Well I see ... eventually plots like paintings can be too interpreted from different perspectives. Of course, I see that you believe that Iwaki is too good for Katou. I don't agree on that but I respect your choice ^^ About the other matter, it is true that if the mangaka wanted to complicate things then Iwaki would have brought up the subject of that woman along with the orgy and expressed his frustration at Katou wondering how he can trust him or if he had said the truth about that woman (if he hid the info about the orgy then maybe he lied elsewhere). However, Iwaki who was really absorbed in his thoughts about this matter, chose to forget about it saying that it is one of those "petty" matters from the past after he looked in the eyes of the startled Katou and his facial expressions at the moment he rushed to save Iwaka, risking his own life in the process. From my own perspective, I think he forgave him and then made love to him because he thought that such affection couldn't be faked. It was genuine and that what mattered to him. I won't drag this any further because I do respect your point of view but it seems again from Iwaki's words and actions that Katou is worthy of respect both on a personal and professional levels. He did say after all that he as an actor, sees Katou as a rival, and this entices him to excel and do even more. From the manga's progress we could see too that he has made an effort to become more mature. That was Iwaki's opinion of him ... Could Iwaki have been better off with someone other than Katou? I say "no" but if you say "yes", then it is also a valid opinion. I won't dislike your topic for this because I already voted with a like. It is the diversity of opinions between fans which makes the feedback interesting ^^
Well I see ... eventually plots like paintings can be too interpreted from different perspectives. Of course, I see that you believe that Iwaki is too good for Katou. I don't agree on that but I respect your ch... Lilas
But if you see from another point of view, you can see that Iwaki was a very proud man. So actually, I really want to know where all that pride has gone to. If Katou had really matured, more things should have changed by then, he wouldn't do so many petty and pathetic things. In Iwaki's case, love can blind people too. And, by the way, when someone falls by your side, whether you like him or not you may act by instinct. Anyone would feel startled at the fact that someone might die by your side, so I don't really count that as a demonstration of love. And I don't really care about likes and dislikes, since everyone has a different opinion, and that's what makes it good to have a conversation. Talk with people who has the same perspective is really tiring. However, I do admit that some people get a little bit...well.. agressive. And I am glad you are not one of those. Anyway, it is aways nice to know how other people see things -3
It isn't a bad manga, but Katou is a spoiled brat. An orgy? Really? The matter isn't that it was an orgy, the matter is that he did that when they were already together. I think Iwaki is just too good for him.
After doing that, I don't think he even has the right to be jealous over anything. （￣へ￣）
Do u remember what chapter it is ?
41 if I am not wrong. Iwaki finds out through Katou's friends ^^
Ok thanks :) it's been so long since I've read this one
you're welcome ^^. It is quite cute, but I felt sad for Iwaki xD
Well, at first, they weren't so deep into the relationship xD And them being AV actors, things like that were bound to happen.
Maybe, but by then Katou already said that he loved him, and started living together. I think if it came out of his own mouth, it wouldn't be so bad. If he wasn't even sure about what he was feeling or his sexuality, he shouldn't have said that he loved him to start with.
After he got that right, then he should say that (=・ω・=).But, well, that's just what I think xD
Well I also don't like cheating themes in mangas, however on a cheating scale the most impersonal form is orgy because it is solely based on sex, it is even a bohemian, erratic and circumstantial (under the spur of the moment) form of sex. The most personal form of cheating would be having a mistress or a lover along with the "official" one.
At first I didn't like this particular piece of news, I didn't see it coming given the fact how much Katou is possessive of Iwaki-san. However, after listening to Katou's explanation and taking into consideration that he has a childish part in him, it is no surprise that he cheated and hid it. From his perspective, it wasn't "cheating" because back then he said that Iwaki was not reciprocating his feelings, the thing which was making him unhappy and drove him maybe into despair. It is true that he moved to Iwaki's apartment but for him he wanted the same intensity he was showing to Iwaki (he said that he was being "cold" towards him back then).
However, being the person he is (with that childish aspect in his personality) he retreated into a familiar shell (sex) instead of working his way through his "problem" and waiting till Iwaki opens up to him the way he wanted to.
From his perspective, he had doubts (maybe Iwaki didn't love him, maybe this "thing" wasn't going to work out), hence the orgy was supposed to be a test (maybe after doing it, he will discover that all his feelings for Iwaki were an illusion - after all, and in spite of the fact that he used to be a "lady - killer", he has fallen for a man, which is unusual given his past - and if that were to happen, then he would have found a way out of his unhappiness).
This way of thinking is to be expected because all what Katou had in the past were flings and I don't believe that he was in a serious relationship before or that he had these intense feelings towards someone before.
If he were a little bit more experienced, a little bit more mature, he wouldn't have doubted his feelings and hence wouldn't have cheated.
For me this orgy "affair" is exactly like when a child is sulking and starts to break things out of spite.
Not telling Iwaki about it and insisting that he would never tell him something like that (even if there were other similar "mistakes") because he didn't want to see him hurt and crying, is part of this irrational bratful but still wonderful madness which characterizes Katou. Iwaki understands that and this is why he forgave him, especially after he saw his reactions when Iwaki was going to fall from the bridge.
For me Iwaki compensates for whatever Katou lacks, if he weren't mature, strong and generous (because forgiving is a form of generosity) this relationship would have never worked and if Katou weren't bratful (but still genuinely affectionate, caring and passionate towards Iwaki), Iwaki wouldn't have loved him back.
In a sense, they complete each other.
Hence this is a well-thought of and touching romance story (with adult themes to spike it).
I get your point. However, his explanation was nothing else than his own indecisivisiness, I think it's normal to be kind of freaked out by the fact that you fell in love with a person of the same sex, but before you do anything like commitment, you should be sure of what you want. If going to that orgy party would make him feel assured about what he was feeling, the least he could do out of respect for Iwaki was to tell him with his own words at some point.
We can see pretty clearly how much Katou loves Iwaki, I agree, but..in some sense, he has always been lying. Like in that incident right at the start, where Katou was seen with some woman, I agree that they might be just friends..but, at the time, he said that He wouldn't cheat on him;That he loved him; And all the same, he would get angry whenever Katou was with anyone, but with what right?
Katou is indeed a brat, but if he would have given this enough thought out of guilty, I think he would have grown a little. I actually just felt disappointed, because I did think they were a good couple. However, exactly for Iwaki being mature, I don't think the person he loves back would neccessarily be a brat like Katou. In other words, I just think he deserves someone better.
^^
Well I see ... eventually plots like paintings can be too interpreted from different perspectives. Of course, I see that you believe that Iwaki is too good for Katou. I don't agree on that but I respect your choice ^^
About the other matter, it is true that if the mangaka wanted to complicate things then Iwaki would have brought up the subject of that woman along with the orgy and expressed his frustration at Katou wondering how he can trust him or if he had said the truth about that woman (if he hid the info about the orgy then maybe he lied elsewhere).
However, Iwaki who was really absorbed in his thoughts about this matter, chose to forget about it saying that it is one of those "petty" matters from the past after he looked in the eyes of the startled Katou and his facial expressions at the moment he rushed to save Iwaka, risking his own life in the process.
From my own perspective, I think he forgave him and then made love to him because he thought that such affection couldn't be faked. It was genuine and that what mattered to him.
I won't drag this any further because I do respect your point of view but it seems again from Iwaki's words and actions that Katou is worthy of respect both on a personal and professional levels. He did say after all that he as an actor, sees Katou as a rival, and this entices him to excel and do even more. From the manga's progress we could see too that he has made an effort to become more mature. That was Iwaki's opinion of him ...
Could Iwaki have been better off with someone other than Katou? I say "no" but if you say "yes", then it is also a valid opinion.
I won't dislike your topic for this because I already voted with a like. It is the diversity of opinions between fans which makes the feedback interesting ^^
But if you see from another point of view, you can see that Iwaki was a very proud man. So actually, I really want to know where all that pride has gone to. If Katou had really matured, more things should have changed by then, he wouldn't do so many petty and pathetic things. In Iwaki's case, love can blind people too.
And, by the way, when someone falls by your side, whether you like him or not you may act by instinct. Anyone would feel startled at the fact that someone might die by your side, so I don't really count that as a demonstration of love.
And I don't really care about likes and dislikes, since everyone has a different opinion, and that's what makes it good to have a conversation. Talk with people who has the same perspective is really tiring. However, I do admit that some people get a little bit...well.. agressive. And I am glad you are not one of those.
Anyway, it is aways nice to know how other people see things -3