rainbowpandas23's activites

My question is: What would a bdsm/ kinky bl manga or manhwa need to have or not have in order for you to consider it "good"? What makes a bdsm/kinky bl manga or manhwa "bad"? Like, what are you all looking for when you're reading a kink or bdsm series:

- super consent forward and explicitly negotiated depictions of bdsm with little to no conflict
- realistic depictions of kink with realistically written characters including miscommunications, complex feelings and grey area situations
- pure fantasy where we readers can just assume things are negotiated
- something else or a blend of the above

Lately there have been a few BDSM/ kink manga and manhwa that have displayed very great in mental, emotional, and physical aspects of kink but eventually develop conflict in the negotiation/ emotion/ communication aspect. So many people have been getting really upset about those conflicts and begin absolutely tearing those series to shreds despite them not being finished or the issues being, in my opinion, pretty realistic OR acceptable for fictional story drama. I absolutely understand people being upset when certain things happen in a story with BDSM/ kink as a focus but I also feel like a lot of nuance and grey area is being judged in favor of looking for unrealistically high standards in BDSM/ kink content.

I've been in the kink scene for over a decade in many different types of dynamics, I'm friends with many prodommes/ kinky sex workers, I volunteer with a nonprofit that is a community space for queer adults (with a huge overlap in the kink and sex work community), and I've been an educator in the kink scene for over 5 years. Kink is a HUGE part of my life and my everyday experience and the comments of all these BDSM bl is making me curious. I just wanted to start a dialogue, see what people are looking for in order to consider something a genuinely good bdsm/ kink series, what things are making people decide a good series has gone bad, and how does that vary from person to person?

I'm probably in the minority here but I actually really like how this story is going. A service top who only got started domming for the person he likes and a brat who doesn't realize that he's using his bratty behavior as armor to protect himself who are both in their young 20's, figuring things out in incredibly messy ways, is so compelling to me. It hurts and it's not easy to read but I really like reading flawed characters reacting poorly and miscommunicating in realistic ways. ESPECIALLY when there are facets of their relationship that are very grey, personal, and nuanced like a BDSM/ kink dynamic.

My heart breaks for both of them rn. The fact that the sub lied bc he was afraid the truth would hurt his bf/ didn't want to face what really happened is a very common trauma response for people who were sexually assaulted. The fact that the Dom didn't trust him and reacted so angrily and coldly in the way that the bratty sub "trained" him to makes sense. The fact that the sub broke down because he saw how much he actually hurt his bf and got dropped into the stages of grief head first absolutely makes sense. The fact that the Dom kicked the sub out because he felt betrayed and was lied to which made him decide he couldn't handle being "toyed" with by the sub anymore absolutely makes sense. I don't blame either of them. This is all so messy but not in any way that's malicious. They're both hurting and acting in accordance to their own pain, trauma, established role in the relationship, and the knowledge they have at the time. It's really heavy but it's also really real. I don't say any of that to defend any of their actions, just to say I understand them.

If y'all want a fluffy and smutty bdsm story with little to no conflict, that's so valid. I also would love more stories like that. But just because this story has complex conflict AND has BDSM/ kink as a big factor in the narrative, it doesn't mean this is a bad BDSM story OR a bad representation of BDSM/ kink. I honestly think this is quite a good representation of kink within the context of the story. Like, showing people how kink can clash with hurt personal feelings is so valuable. I can't tell you how many times I've consented to something in a scene because I thought I was okay with it when we negotiated, felt not great about it during the scene but powered through because of my own internal stuff and then realized afterwards how much that thing hurt me. But that hurt wasn't my domme's fault, not at all. It wasn't my fault either. It was just something that happened, because me and my domme are both people with flaws and many emotions who are just doing our best. But this is where things like RACK and PRICK come into play. And the FRIES acronym for consent. This is also where consent purity culture can become really harmful, when people start trying to blame or judge or project all over someone else's dynamic.

There's so much more I want to talk about here because people who practice BDSM are flawed and have trauma and miscommunicate and make mistakes and take things personally, like every other human on this planet. There is no way for anyone to perfectly engage in kink, that's literally impossible. But seeing two characters practice the kink acts themselves in fairly accurate and safely depicted ways while having problems with their dynamic/ communication/ internal emotional pain is something I'm glad to see. I hope the author is aiming for a "A Terrible Romance" kind of arc because I think this will be a masterpiece if so.

Imagine kink shaming a "friend" so hard that you help commit a b&e and vandalism against them. Just let them have consensual fun and match each other's freak, my guy. It hurts you literally 0% to let your friends do what makes them happy in their consenting adult relationships

I mean, part of me says all that with levity but I also know the crap that the kink, queer, and kinky queer communities have had to deal with irl for decades so....smh.

I'm looking forward to Hoseob helping to get the shitty ex arrested though, that'll be satisfying.

Chap 16 definitely got skipped, right?

And this is seriously hard because the sub definitely was betraying the dom's trust and trying to make the Dom upset on purpose. The sub clearly never wanted to go so far as to cheat, he clearly doesn't want to actually betray him or damage their bond. He only pushes on the things he knows he'll be forgiven for. But in his attempt to tease and goad with the express desire of hurting his bf like he felt hurt, something awful happened to him. Like, I can't even imagine how awful the sub feels right now. My heart breaks for him. But, at the same time, if the Dom gets upset due to his trust being broken, it would make sense. Even though the assault was absolutely NOT the sub's fault at all in any way, the dom's trust was still being broken before the sub blacked out. It would make sense if he doesn't trust anything the sub says after that and then reacts the way he usually does when the sub pushes him.

I mean, that's the dynamic that the sub kept building between them. That's the pattern. Sub pushes Dom by lying/ threatening to cheat/ going out without communicating/ ignoring him/ preying on his insecurities, the Dom catches him in some situation of the sub skating the line or crossing a boundary, the sub is cocky/ doesn't express remorse, the Dom "takes the bait" and punishes the sub just like the sub wanted him to, and then rinse and repeat.

And they've both fallen into a pattern where they don't really communicate healthily or vulnerably so if they don't actually talk or don't hear each other, it makes sense. It sucks but it actually makes sense compared to other similar series. It's a complicated and difficult situation. But I know this author. They don't write lighthearted comedy stuff. They write real, complicated, raw, contradictory emotions and situations that hurt in very human ways because they take their characters seriously. They write stories where people hurt each other and make the wrong choices on purpose because of fear and trauma and hubris. I have no doubt that this is gonna be a tough read moving forward but, if it's anything like their other work, it's gonna lead to a lot of growth and healing for these characters.

"Haneul, self-proclaimed campus flirt, has big dreams of landing a relationship in college. But...

...

They love each other so much it's stupid. Like, look how cute and dumb they are (and totally ignore the emotional damage we all see rapidly approaching)

My fantasy brain really enjoys this series. There's enough legit BDSM info, explicitly shown enthusiastic consent, and realistic practices to keep me turned on and engaged but not so much that it becomes boring/ clinical. The kink/ smut is hot, I like the characters, and I think this series has a lot of potential. I thought the last chapter was hot af.

My reality brain also still enjoys it overall but I, much like many other irl kinksters, I could write an essay (and pretty much have across multiple comment threads) on where there are problems, where things are nuanced, where things are totally fine, and where readers are projecting all over a fictional couple engaging in not real BDSM. I would genuinely love a story where flawed people are shown engaging in BDSM and how they mess up, miscommunicate, have fun, learn their limits, process their feelings, and grow. That's the most realistic and healthy depiction of kink to me, tbh. Let it be flawed and use that as a way to help the characters grow as well as educate the readers.

My advice is to read this with an open mind and grain of salt and if you still don't like it, that's totally fine. You're valid and you shouldn't read stuff you don't like. But at the same time, maybe refrain from saying this series is toxic/ unhealthy as if it's irredeemable or that people enjoying this overall decent kink series means they're enabling toxic behavior or don't know how healthy BDSM works. And if you're gonna get angry at fictional characters for not practicing BDSM to an unrealistically perfect standard, either do some research/ talk to people who DO engage in kink IRL or write the story you want to see.

FINALLY. I'm so here for JH actually realizing how and why his behavior during all this drama wasn't cool, that he's giving Garam the space he asked for, that he's admitting and remorse-ing for how he was wrong/hurtful, and letting that coexist with his love for Garam without PUTTING his expectations or hurt feelings on Garam. That shit isn't easy but it's the growth that I've been wanting sooooo bad this whole time he was being a dick. Give that entitled rich boy with straight privilege his reality check and character growth so that he can love Garam how he deserves to be loved, it's everything I wanna read.

And i'm all for Garam going to see JH after he had the time to process and feel what he needed to feel. They needed that balance and I wanted to see Garam admit and face the things he wants instead of settling for "good enough". I just really hope that they've both learned from this and are able to take a step forward together as people.

I stg, you can tell this author is a really good writer and that I love these characters because I get SO frustrated when they're being idiots or immature jerks. It's like when you have real life friends who keep making the worst choices for themselves, despite KNOWING who they are and what they're capable of, and you know those bad choices won't solve their problems AND that they won't listen to your advice so you just have to sit there because you want to support and celebrate with them when they're through it all and better on the other side. But it doesn't change how much you want to shake them by their shoulders yelling "what the fuck are you actually doing my dude???" the entire time they're going through the frustrating phase of the "climbing out of rock bottom" cycle.

I'm waiting with bated breath for the next chapter, I think it's gonna be messy but worth it.

I still think this is a pretty good bdsm/ kink series all things considered but any real life dom who knowingly brings personal negative feelings into a scene to "take it out" on someone without the submissive's consent is bad heckin news. If they bring those feelings in by accident (we're all human, sometimes emotions get tangled up or come out in ways we don't expect) that's one thing. But knowing you feel genuinely angry/ hurt and using that anger/ hurt against your partner without them actively consenting to that type of dynamic? That clashes with a lot of consent forward mentalities that are super important in the kink scene and in relationships, especially BDSM ones.

It's happened twice so far in this series but the first time it felt more accidental/ unintentional and he owned up to it. But this second time it's super intentional and feels manipulative in a way that isn't kinky consenting fun.

I'm definitely still hopeful for this series and can forgive this if it's addressed and handled.

*Edit: After sitting on it, I think I'm less concerned than I was before. Not because any of that stuff is cool irl but because I think it makes for an interesting story to see a flawed Dom struggling to heal after a traumatic experience and reapproaching kink with someone he's in a genuine relationship with.

Navigating BDSM is complicated irl too sometimes. We're all flawed people and we're all learning. I think this story has the potential to tell a story with layers like that super well. And if this series isn't gonna tell that type of story and is just a kinky smutty fun time, I still think this is a pretty good read. It's a lot lot better for kinky smutty fun time than a decent amoung of BDSM manga/manwha because they're both genuinely having fun and care about each other.

I totally get if some people get turned off if bdsm/kink in media isn't well represented when they were really wanting and expecting it to be. That's super valid and there are times I feel that way with certain stories/ shows. That said, I'm always happy to have discussions about real life kink/ bdsm and help educate people about what is and isn't cool while also enjoying the fun unrealistic fantasy in a fictional series like this one.

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